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	<title>Comments on: Succeeding in spite of schools</title>
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	<link>http://edinsanity.com/2008/04/14/succeeding-in-spite-of-schools/</link>
	<description>“Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results.”  Albert Einstein</description>
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		<title>By: Marshall</title>
		<link>http://edinsanity.com/2008/04/14/succeeding-in-spite-of-schools/comment-page-1/#comment-145</link>
		<dc:creator>Marshall</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 21 Apr 2008 19:52:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://edinsanity.wordpress.com/?p=92#comment-145</guid>
		<description>Jon

No writings.  No URL.  Just perceptions.  Like I said, &quot;novice&quot; is a compliment.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Jon</p>
<p>No writings.  No URL.  Just perceptions.  Like I said, &#8220;novice&#8221; is a compliment.</p>
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		<title>By: Jon Becker</title>
		<link>http://edinsanity.com/2008/04/14/succeeding-in-spite-of-schools/comment-page-1/#comment-147</link>
		<dc:creator>Jon Becker</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 21 Apr 2008 04:15:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://edinsanity.wordpress.com/?p=92#comment-147</guid>
		<description>Thanks for the comment, Marshall, and well said.  Please feel free to leave your blog&#039;s URL so I can read more of your writing!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks for the comment, Marshall, and well said.  Please feel free to leave your blog&#8217;s URL so I can read more of your writing!</p>
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		<title>By: Marshall</title>
		<link>http://edinsanity.com/2008/04/14/succeeding-in-spite-of-schools/comment-page-1/#comment-146</link>
		<dc:creator>Marshall</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 21 Apr 2008 01:21:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://edinsanity.wordpress.com/?p=92#comment-146</guid>
		<description>Jon

Wow - a week almost with this post, and no comments?  The stories are there, but maybe we are reluctant to share them for some reason.  Embarassment, shame, failure?  Do those of us in the schools (by the way, I&#039;m included in the brick and mortar) feel that we have let them down?  To some degree, I know that I do.  Are the &quot;digital natives&quot; (how about &quot;diginetics&quot; or &quot;techbred&quot; or maybe even &quot;techintrinsic&quot; as alternatives that are at least fun) succeeding despite our best efforts of conformity?  How about those of us that believe we support these people to some degree, but struggle to complete that transaction fully?  For example, since information is more important to be accessed than memorized, why test facts form memory?  If we did not test facts, the argument of preventing cell phones and laptops in schools would fade (now only the fact that the communication is used for forbidden activities such as drugs, sex, etc. would prevent their use).  The largest fact we face in my high school are my teachers&#039; fears that students will cheat on their tests, homework, etc.  I would argue that this is exactly what we do as adults in a more controlled situation.  Don&#039;t we pick each others&#039; brains?  Don&#039;t we ask if we don&#039;t know?  What is a good worker - the ability to find and use the information needed and do so in a pleasant and respectful manner with colleagues and co-workers?  If so, and I argue that it is, we should continue the &quot;brick and mortar&quot; as a placeto learn the social skills and interactions necessary for life as we build on the how to find and use information, not memorization.

As for stories, yes, I&#039;ve had students that went on to do great things well beyond their technological preparation in high school.  These successes, however, have manifested in music, athletics, math, science, agriculture, and industrial technology.  In each, I could present a name, indicating that I have fallen short of providing them enough support while equally creating enough challenge to meet their needs.

I realize that bloggers (of which I am new and consider myself novice at best) are technologically proficient and understand the use well beyond many of us.  I would contend, however, it would be much like doctors feeling that everyone should be well-educated in health issues and habits, motorcyclists feeling that HS graduates should understand highway right of way concepts, or bankers would expect us all to fully understand how to effectively use credit.  These are all very important to everyone, but knowing how to run a tig-welder has helped more than one of my students become much more productive and happy in their own life than any of the above skills could have provided without that skill.  Bottom line - tech is important, but it can&#039;t be everything.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Jon</p>
<p>Wow &#8211; a week almost with this post, and no comments?  The stories are there, but maybe we are reluctant to share them for some reason.  Embarassment, shame, failure?  Do those of us in the schools (by the way, I&#8217;m included in the brick and mortar) feel that we have let them down?  To some degree, I know that I do.  Are the &#8220;digital natives&#8221; (how about &#8220;diginetics&#8221; or &#8220;techbred&#8221; or maybe even &#8220;techintrinsic&#8221; as alternatives that are at least fun) succeeding despite our best efforts of conformity?  How about those of us that believe we support these people to some degree, but struggle to complete that transaction fully?  For example, since information is more important to be accessed than memorized, why test facts form memory?  If we did not test facts, the argument of preventing cell phones and laptops in schools would fade (now only the fact that the communication is used for forbidden activities such as drugs, sex, etc. would prevent their use).  The largest fact we face in my high school are my teachers&#8217; fears that students will cheat on their tests, homework, etc.  I would argue that this is exactly what we do as adults in a more controlled situation.  Don&#8217;t we pick each others&#8217; brains?  Don&#8217;t we ask if we don&#8217;t know?  What is a good worker &#8211; the ability to find and use the information needed and do so in a pleasant and respectful manner with colleagues and co-workers?  If so, and I argue that it is, we should continue the &#8220;brick and mortar&#8221; as a placeto learn the social skills and interactions necessary for life as we build on the how to find and use information, not memorization.</p>
<p>As for stories, yes, I&#8217;ve had students that went on to do great things well beyond their technological preparation in high school.  These successes, however, have manifested in music, athletics, math, science, agriculture, and industrial technology.  In each, I could present a name, indicating that I have fallen short of providing them enough support while equally creating enough challenge to meet their needs.</p>
<p>I realize that bloggers (of which I am new and consider myself novice at best) are technologically proficient and understand the use well beyond many of us.  I would contend, however, it would be much like doctors feeling that everyone should be well-educated in health issues and habits, motorcyclists feeling that HS graduates should understand highway right of way concepts, or bankers would expect us all to fully understand how to effectively use credit.  These are all very important to everyone, but knowing how to run a tig-welder has helped more than one of my students become much more productive and happy in their own life than any of the above skills could have provided without that skill.  Bottom line &#8211; tech is important, but it can&#8217;t be everything.</p>
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